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Former CIA Asset Blows The Whistle On Big Intel | MSOM Ep. 928

February 08, 2024 Episode 928
PATRIOT.TV
Former CIA Asset Blows The Whistle On Big Intel | MSOM Ep. 928
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Author of "Big Intel: How The CIA And FBI Went From Cold War heroes To Deep State Villians" explains the transformation of the agencies to the enemy of the state they have become today.

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Speaker 6:

Welcome to Making Sense of the Madness. I am Jason Burmuss. Today we got a jam-packed show for you. We've got a former Central Intelligence Agency asset and the author of Big Intel really exploring how far we've come since the Cold War into now and what the FBI and the CIA really are and unfortunately they're not what they once were. J Michael Waller, buckle up and get ready to make sense of the madness. And we are back. We are joined by J Michael Waller. He's the author of Big Intel and thank you for joining us. Before we get into the book and why you decided to write the book, tell us about your history, not only with the Central Intelligence Agency, but working in intelligence in general.

Speaker 7:

It started out as a complete amateur, so I was never a CIA employee or went to the farm for training. I was picked up as a private sector asset by old OSS operatives. These were veterans of World War II who were in the Office of Strategic Services fighting the Nazis, and they were looking now, at the time of President Reagan's first term, for young amateurs to go out and do what the CIA could not do.

Speaker 6:

And you were stationed in South America, correct? So what does somebody that gets picked up by these guys? I'm glad you talked about the OSS, because that was basically the Office of Strategic Services, which was pre-CIA and really more involved in that World War II era, the CIA being born out of that era. What do they actually recruit you to do in South America? Can you even tell us?

Speaker 7:

Oh, yeah, yeah, because I was never a formal CIA employee, I can say whatever I want about those experiences there's because it was all funded. That I learned many years later out of the pocket of CIA director Bill Casey, who was Reagan's CIA director and who had been in the OSS. So he did everything off the books and so there was no need for him to testify to Congress about any of this. They couldn't force him to testify and there was no taxpayer money involved.

Speaker 6:

So I mean, what were you doing there?

Speaker 7:

Oh OK, it was a private parallel system that Casey set up because he did not trust the CIA's ability, or really inability at the time. They somehow could not find links of Soviet support for international terrorism. They somehow couldn't find a lot of ties for Soviet support for international subversion against us to threaten us into unilateral nuclear disarmament and to support communist insurgencies aimed at encircling us and taking us down. So CIA wasn't able to either collect the intelligence or to conclude from the intelligence what the Soviets were doing. So Casey went out and he had his old friends from the OSS get other people to do that work people on the outside, people who were not trained on how not to think, people who could really go in and mix with local populations and get trusted. Now I could never be mistaken for a Nicaraguan or a Salvadoran, but I was able to build relationships down there as a kid. They trusted me, I trusted them, we worked with each other and so I brought back intelligence on what the Soviets were doing to support these communist revolutionary movements on our southern border.

Speaker 6:

So how long did the relationship with the agency last, and then you got into private intelligence. Tell us about that.

Speaker 7:

It lasted as long as Casey was director and then, because he was the one running it, it ended when he retired, so that was around 1987. I stayed with the Contras in Nicaragua later on as a contractor for a different US government agency to train the Contras. It was really supposed to be to train them in democratization. I was training them in psychological operations on my own. So I was sort of abusing the privilege that was to continue the work that I had done previously, because it morphed from my work to collect intelligence on what the Soviets were doing in the Soviet block to working on my own initiative to train the Contras in psychological operations against the Sandinistas and then working with the Army of El Salvador against the communist guerrillas there. So I was the insurgent side against the communist government in Nicaragua and the counterinsurgent side against the communist insurgency in El Salvador. That lasted till 1987, but I was actually involved down in Central America until 1991, but it was all on my own initiative. By this time we had set up our own private intelligence networks that succeeded what Casey had been doing.

Speaker 6:

So I got to ask you. This is happening during the infamous Iran-Contra affair and obviously a lot of this coming out in Congress. You just mentioned that Bill Casey was running this off the books for those unfamiliar with some of the specifics of what was going on, as you had Israel buying weapons I believe it was from Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia they were the ones shipping them down to the Contras. Then the Contras would basically be allowed to ship up drugs and other items into the United States through the Central Intelligence Agency. You know this was a time of not only Oliver North but many people actually being convicted. So what was that experience like? Is that why you ended up moving into private intelligence?

Speaker 7:

Well, it was a bit different from the way you portrayed it. There you had at least two pilots. They were contractor pilots who were flying drugs, so they would fly arms in to Honduras or Costa Rica for the Contras. Then they would load their planes up with drugs on their own and fly back, but because they were CIA contract pilots, it looked like it was a CIA operation. Everything I saw or heard on the ground, none of that ever indicated that they were working for the CIA when they did that. But they were indeed contract pilots. The other part you said was yeah, so I was down there. It was not only Israeli arms that were bought from second markets, but this was after Operation Peace for Galilee and when Ariel Sharon drove the PLO basically into the sea and captured a huge amount of Soviet weaponry. That I saw firsthand because I drove one of the trucks delivering the arms from the port to the Contra camp.

Speaker 6:

Wow, this is going to be a super interesting hour, I got to tell you. So, all right, so you have that experience. You spend four more years down in South America. What type of operations are you doing there? And then, what do you move into after that, after you leave South America?

Speaker 7:

Well, it was all back and forth, so I wasn't stationed down there for any great length of time because I was first. I was an undergrad in college. When I was starting this, I was 21 years old. I had no idea what I was doing and I didn't know at the time that I was doing it for the CIA. I was working as a student journalist and somebody in the White House who I got to know as a kid was running things. His name was Constantine Menges. He was a CIA national intelligence officer running Western Hemisphere programs at the NSC National Security Council and you mentioned Iran Contra. He told me one thing. He said whatever you do, don't talk to that Lieutenant Colonel, he's going to get you into trouble.

Speaker 2:

And I didn't know who that.

Speaker 7:

Lieutenant Colonel was at the time, but it ended up being Holly North.

Speaker 6:

Unbelievable. All right, so you're in that Cold War era. The Cold War is one Russia, for some time actually becomes our ally. Did it feel kind of like mission accomplished at that point? Or what was your view of the Central Intelligence Agency and even the FBI? Is there kind of in the subtitle and you think that they've also been captured as deep state villains at this point? What was your view of them? You know, late 80s, early 90s, when this started to come to fruition.

Speaker 7:

I Didn't really. I had a good view of what the CIA was doing on the covert level, because I saw how it was set up it was. It was efficient, it was cost-effective, it was doing the job. It was actually succeeding better than anybody had thought, because you, it had a. There was a peasant army that was the largest Latin American guerrilla army since the Mexican Revolution in a tiny country like Nicaragua, and it was really a legitimate fighting force that, without CIA support and support from other countries and and the private sector, they would not have been able to raise the army and get the equipment that they needed to to fight. What I saw, though, was the CIA was not it was never a right-wing organization. It fought communism from the left, so it worked to co-opt people on the left meaning the Democratic left, the Socialist left, the soft center left and To build broader coalition, so it was never a right-wing, anti-communist entity, and that's what really surprised me at the time, because I I was then as now, a pretty hardcore anti-communist.

Speaker 6:

So when I look at the Central Intelligence Agency, you know, obviously I think of corruption in both the FBI and the CIA. When you look at figures like Martin Luther King Jr or, obviously, jfk, etc. However, I do feel like there has been a huge escalation Since the Cold War and I think a lot of that also took place under George H W Bush, who was the head of the CIA and then the vice president, while a lot of this transformation Came and you saw more and more, I would say, centralized executive power that was beyond the president, the continuity of government program was expanding, the national program's Office was expanding and eventually, when you get to post 9-11, you have not only the Patriot Act but Homeland Security and, I would argue now, a CIA and FBI that are completely out of control. So what was the motivation for this book? Why target the FBI and CIA Directly and why specify that you know these guys were Cold War heroes but now seem to be deep-state villains?

Speaker 7:

So I wrote the book actually it was the suggestion of the publisher, who who asked me to write the book on the CIA and I said let's expand it to the FBI, because I knew both the agency and the FBI enough to to and had enough inside knowledge of them and you know, a lifetime of experience with people from both organizations. So I was really concerned with their wokeness and how they ended up embracing critical theory, cultural Marxism, to become these woke entities to To where the FBI now becomes a political police and it's policing, yeah, free speech and it's. It's. It's really overstepped any, any bounds that it oversteps before in its history. It's really over steps now because it affects every American citizen now.

Speaker 6:

Well, I would argue, obviously, Especially the central intelligence agency has had its fingers in a number of other agencies. You know, we've seen that throughout history. You know the cross-pollination of the FBI and the CIA, as well as the turf wars, have been well documented over the years. I think what is alarming is obviously you have now also X intel officers that are working with big tech, and the question is whether or not these people are actually X intel officers at all. I'm wondering are you aware of the signature reduction program that Newsweek reported on a couple years ago?

Speaker 7:

I Heard about it, but I don't know the one in particular. But you're raising a huge point, so let's talk about that for a second.

Speaker 6:

Is. We often talk about, for instance, the Twitter files, where you see obvious collusion Within our government and what's okay to be put on social media. But signature reduction, to me, is even more alarming because it's 60,000 people. They're working for the Pentagon, yet signature reduction is actually not the official name of the program. It's more of an art form and they're in every big company you can imagine. There's 60,000 of them in this country. So are they working with these former intelligence officers? Are they in companies like Google and Twitter, etc? And I would say the the lines have been blurred so much between what big tech and big government are and Facilitated by these agencies and beyond that we don't really know. I mean, what are your thoughts?

Speaker 7:

Well, yeah, we don't know. I'm not familiar with that program to comment, but it rings true with other things that I do know, or at least I'm aware of. What you have is you think of what the FBI was set up to do or what the CIA was set up to do? Fundamentally was, in a nutshell, to to preserve what J Edgar Hoover called the American way of life, and we can say what we want about any of the people running it, but the fact is that's what they were set up to do. The CIA was set up literally to defend the United States as part of a strategy of communism. How well it did, that is another question. Let me get mission creep, national security, writ large, doing things in the name of national security in quotes and then anointing themselves to be this soul, custodians of national security, to the point where People in Congress don't know, can't know, won't know, don't want to know. So there are a few laws against a lot of what's happening with this mission creep, and then blanket laws are drafted which then provide a legal basis for that mission creep. And then, once you achieve your objective, oh, the Cold War is over now, what do we do? So you're looking for another function. It doesn't mean we disband the CIA because the Soviet Union collapses. We do need a foreign intelligence service. We do need means, short of military force, to to achieve American military or American objectives, to make sure that we have free trade, to make sure that no one's going to try to subvert us. That kind of thing that's necessary. The danger comes when the people sworn to defend against subversion Are the ones who are subverting us. So, and I think that More and more clear, right?

Speaker 6:

I'm sorry, go ahead, yeah, yeah absolutely Absolutely so.

Speaker 7:

so After 9-11, you know, the CIA was really not doing a whole lot. It was really moribund and the morale was poor up through the 90s. And then 9-11 hits 2001, and then it's given every kind of authority imaginable, as is the FBI. President Bush told brand new FBI Director, robert Mueller, you will make sure that no other American is attacked in our country ever again. That's a nice thing for a president to watch, but what does that mean? That means you create a massive centralized FBI which had been decentralized before. It needed to initiate its criminal cases from the 56 field offices at the local level, not from the center, but instead you had two layers of huge management bureaucracies created at the top of the FBI, and it was run from the top down, accompanied by a new Department of Homeland Security, with old and new agencies combined and pulled out of other government departments into one centralized security you know, ministry of Security almost. And then you had the 17 different intelligence agencies, which were designed to be independent from one another, now joined together at the top by the by a director of national intelligence. So you have a centralization of all of this like we never had, with draconian laws behind it, like the Patriot Act, which people argued at the time and I think it was it was the right thing to do at the time. This law is so dangerous it has to expire and drop dead after a certain number of years to four or five years. That was okay if the law expired, but instead Congress kept renewing it, and mindlessly renewing it, giving more and more and more power to this growing central apparatus that was on a constant search for enemies.

Speaker 6:

Well, I would also argue it's even more than that. You have the NDA. Every year you have the Military Commissions Act. You just mentioned Homeland Security and you mentioned Robert Mueller, who was the fresh director. Well, the deputy director of the FBI was a guy named Michael Chertoff, and they gave him Homeland Security initially as well, and guys like Chertoff also heavily invested in that security state that they built. He was very much behind the companies that brought us the body scanners at airports. I want to get further into the book. We got to take a break. It is making sense of the madness. The book is big intel. How the CIA and FBI went from Cold War heroes to deep state villains will be back after this.

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Speaker 4:

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Speaker 5:

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Speaker 6:

We are back with J Michael Waller and we were discussing the emergence of more of these agencies and acts that not only consolidated power but created more authoritarianism. We talked a little bit about Homeland Security. They also had put in privatized fusion centers that have also expanded and are around to this day At this point, with our Intel services, not just the CIA and the FBI isn't there already too much of a public-private partnership and really zero criminal accountability in most cases, if not all?

Speaker 7:

Yeah, sure, if you put yourself back at 9-11, it seemed like a good idea at the time. This is where things get dangerous when things seem like a great idea, let's just give great authority and throw money at it. The whole idea of the public-private partnerships was the private sector. So this is the big tech move at Silicon Valley happening at this time. The private sector can do things much more quickly and efficiently and comprehensive than the government sector. Let's have a partnership. What does that mean? Who has the authority now? This was the empowerment of places like Google and all these other big tech institutions that have come to haunt us and spy on us and censor us. They were supercharged now with the sort of a deputization from the intelligence community to spy on not just the bad guys abroad, but the American citizens here at home. There are no checks and balances against this.

Speaker 6:

No, there are. Google is really expansive of the programs that they had prior to 9-11. Anybody can look into the case of Hepting versus AT&T and Norris Insight Systems that were partnering with then telecommunication companies like AT&T and Verizon and basically had their own server room and siphoning it directly to the national security agency. As you said, especially post 9-11 and the emergence of the internet and big tech, more and more we saw these outward public-private partnerships. You talk about Google in particular. First of all, google is kind of like a shell company under Alphabet. Of course it owns YouTube it's basically the essence of a technopoly at this point but they've partnered with the national security agency and NASA for years, if not well over a decade at this point, on quantum computing and artificial intelligence. Obviously, those are tools of not only intelligence but military dominance. That line is further blurred. Let's get into the aspect, though, of the central intelligence agency again, a lot of these public-private partnerships. You got people like Michael Griffin very much in the tech space, spacex involved with Musk and their impact on these tech companies and really the narratives, because now Homeland Security has been driven inward. We know now that it's domestic terrorism that they're looking at. Meanwhile, the border is wide open and there's really no talk of the type of Middle Eastern terrorism that we used to talk about during 9-11.

Speaker 7:

Right. That died around 2006. I can say it precisely because I worked with an FBI team agents. One was John Guandolo, who you might know. He's been out for a long time, but we set up a program in the FBI to help them identify jihadis here. How do the networks work? My role in there was because I had been so. I had gotten my experiences as an insurgent, with an insurgency against the communists before. I was one of the only people around with an insurgent mindset, then working with subversive or against subversive movements, counter-subversion. I knew how that worked. We had a whole training program at the FBI Academy so the FBI agents could recognize jihadis and separate, say, a jihadi mosque from a non-jihadi mosque. Most of the mosques are benign, but there are jihadi mosques and their networks, together with various extremist organizations. How do you recognize them? Not crack down on innocent people, not get civil rights groups breathing down your neck for hitting the wrong people and this kind of thing, then making sure the job is done and we get the real terrorists and their networks. This was shut down by 2006 because jihadi the term was found to be offensive. It was insensitive of us to be saying jihadi, jihadis. We couldn't say Islamist, meaning political Islam, we couldn't say Islamic extremists. All those were offensive so the program was shut down.

Speaker 6:

So is this where we start seeing kind of a shift in the language and the culture of these agencies? Because eventually, you know these agencies are going to be looking inward. You know you talk about 2006. Obviously we're in the second term of the second bush Administration and you have players like Wolfowitz and Cheney and Rumsfeld pretty hardcore Neocons, but you put a new face on it with Barack Obama in 2008. However, militarily and these agencies, they still seem to move in that same direction. You know he didn't stop the wars on terror. They all promised they were going to what? Get get rid of Gitmo, close those things down, get out of Iraq. None of that happened. But I would argue that these agencies that had been created, especially Homeland Security, especially the FBI and the CIA, were actually strengthened.

Speaker 7:

Sure? Yeah. Well, this is what happens when you get into a war and you have no exit plan, you have no end state desired, you have no victory plan. Where do we mark victory and then leave? Was it just killing Osama bin Laden? Was it so? Then you had the mission creed. Oh, we're gonna make these countries democracies. We're gonna have now a Multi hundreds of billions of dollar industry to make undemocratic countries Democratic, as if we should even care as American citizens. Just just do our job stabilize the situation. So it's in our interest to leave on our terms and then go. There was never any of that. And at that same time, the Pentagon took out of its official Dictionary of military and associated affairs comes out every year. It's a public document. They removed the term of victory as a military term.

Speaker 6:

Well, I guess we need ever this brings less I. Mean, yeah well, they are forever wars, but they're not wars right, because they haven't declared them. And really that just speaks to me at least, to the entire intelligence apparatus that grew out of World War two. I mean, you could argue we declared war with Korea and the Korea war afterwards, but really after the era of Vietnam we never declared war again and that's kind of shifted the mindset of what these intelligence agencies are supposed to do. So what was your view of the FBI and the CIA during the eight years of the Barack Obama Administration? What did you feel it morphed into?

Speaker 7:

This is where the shift took place. So you already were having a generational shift because the culture was changing. You had what we then called a politically correct culture and the beginnings of canceled culture, so what we call critical theory or wokeness hadn't rooted in yet. But oh, it had rooted in but it hadn't manifested itself yet. So so the new people coming into the FBI and the CIA are coming through these educational systems of most universities in the country With a new mindset now. So you have people who before you had liberals and conservatives who believed in the American founding and American founding principles and the Western moral tradition. You're seeing less and less of that now, and this is where the intolerant Woke-ism comes in, to weed out people who do believe in those things, people who who now believe that the Constitution is a living document that can mean whatever we want to do. It means nothing at all. This gives people with all this mission creed, or people who want to take control of an apparatus for the purpose of exercising control. It gives them legitimacy to say, hey, this is constitutional, when, when really it's not, it was. This type of thing was always seen as a danger. So the change came when Bush brought in a whole lot of new hires, which was necessary, but didn't screen them very well. I was a graduate school professor at the time, teaching people who were going into the FBI and the CIA and and I wouldn't give clearances to a third of them I would never recommend them for clearances, but they were cleared anyway. I got top-secret clearance and and many of them are still in the intelligence community Now. Some were excellent, but others just didn't. So you have people who a mix of excellent people and a mix of people who don't believe in the country. So imagine defending a country that you don't believe in, an attitude where America is a racist society. It was founded by racists. It was built by racists. It's oppressive. The Constitution's oppressive. Thomas Jefferson was oppressive, you know. George Washington was a bad person. So all of our founders were oppressors. And not only that, the whole moral basis behind it, the Judeo-Christian ethic, even the ancient Greco-Roman traditions of Democratic Republic, are now viewed as oppressive, dead white guy stuff that have to be removed. And this is where you get destroying of institutions, destroying of people's confidence in institutions and getting us all to fight against ourselves and imposing, you know, critical marks, critical theory things, cultural marks as things like diversity, equity and inclusion as an ideology on our intelligence community. So this shift began just before Obama took office. The people were coming in as recruits, but Bush had centralized everything so that when somebody like Obama took office he would politicize it from the top like no other person has in our history and bring up those radicals from the bottom and the middle tiers of those bureaucracies put them in the management of the organization. So now they're running the central nervous system of the FBI and the CIA.

Speaker 6:

I want to talk about that system. After this break we are with J Michael Waller. The author of Big Intel will be back after this with more Making Sense of the Madness.

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Speaker 6:

Now we are back at Making Sense of the Madness, before we get back into the centralization of power and movement between the Bush administration and the Barack Obama administration, you mentioned that you wouldn't have approved a third of these people. Were some of the reasons that you could outwardly see that their political motivations were anti-constitutional republic, were anti-founding fathers, or what was it about these recruits? You said some of these people were top tier, the kind of people you would want to see in these agencies. What were some of the flaws you were seeing in the people that you couldn't believe were getting in?

Speaker 7:

A severe lack of self-discipline which allows it makes them open and vulnerable to foreign approaches to compromise them. Financial self-discipline, personal self-discipline things that you don't want someone entrusted with our country's secrets to. You don't want them there because they're not going to have the discipline to keep them and they're not going to have the discipline to put America first and they're easily persuaded to go along with trends or to go along with peer pressure.

Speaker 6:

Interesting. So during the Barack Obama administration, you had people like Cass Sunstein coming out and basically saying free speech was false, advocating for the propaganda and basically lying to the American people. You had the Smith-Mund Act that essentially legalized propaganda against the American people in this country. Doesn't that facilitate the movement of corruption of the FBI and the CIA during this time period?

Speaker 7:

Well, the Smith-Mund Act was a 1950s act that actually made it illegal.

Speaker 6:

It wasn't repealing that Smith-Mund Act? Yeah, it was the repeal.

Speaker 7:

Right, Obama repealed it and that's how we're getting the government propaganda aimed at us. So this was a 1950s law and way back. I talked to someone who had been in aid to Senator Munch back in the 50s. She was there at the time and she said that he didn't say it in public. But the reason Senator Munch was pushing this law was because of the communists who had infiltrated the government at the time. He didn't want them propagandizing the American public.

Speaker 6:

So again, you know you look at that and that kind of empowers this idea. You look at, for instance, the Central Intelligence Agency had, at the end of the Barack Obama administration, John Brennan. You know John Brennan was one of the worst of the worst in my opinion and you could outwardly see I mean I'm not sure if you're aware of the taped Hirsch calls where Hirsch talks about John Brennan and how he felt like John Brennan was the guy that kind of quarterbacked this Russia gate hysteria and collusion against Trump. I mean, what are your thoughts on guys like Brennan who were brought into the agency during that era, who I feel have kind of further facilitated the authoritarian nature of these agencies again that are now focused inward at the American public?

Speaker 7:

John Brennan cast his first vote for president For Gus Hall, who was the old Soviet agent running the US Communist Party. This was not a youthful indiscretion. And even if it was, you don't get hired by the CIA just a few years later after you cast a vote like that, because this is during the Cold War he was doing this and during the Cold War that he was hired by the CIA. So imagine someone with a world view. You hate your country so much that you vote for the enemy to run your country and then the CIA hires you.

Speaker 6:

So I'm guessing you're not a fan of Brennan? Are you telling me you don't like John Brennan? I'm shocked, are you?

Speaker 7:

telling me you don't like John.

Speaker 6:

Brennan. I'm shocked, but I mean Brennan. For me that administration, and Brennan in particular, set up kind of a proxy network. You know I don't necessarily think that the Trump administration and you know I'm not a fan of Pompeo, who he made secretary of state, who had also headed up the agency. I'd love to get your thoughts on him. But I think people like Bill Barr, who was his attorney general, who was formerly came up in the agency, I don't think that he was a friend to Trump and the administration at the end either. I'd love to get your take on those guys.

Speaker 7:

Yeah, these are different issues. I don't cover them at all and begin tell them I'm looking at how these went Woke. So we're going to have policy differences, no matter what, and we're going to have different interpretations of law that I'm not going to pretend to understand, whether it's constitutional law or electoral law. If you look at what what Barr did as attorney general, though, he was very aggressive against the communist Chinese here, he was aggressive against the hottest networks here, so I'm going to give him that much credit. The election issue was a completely different one entirely. Brennan, however, was a Soviet supporter during the cold, I mean when Brezhnev was running the Soviet Union. Now he never learned a lesson from it. He kept it secret. We only know about this because he told the congressional black caucus leaders in it, in a diversity session, that he had voted for the Communist Party. And then that was a hot mic type situation where, where people found out, otherwise, nobody knew. But even in his memoir he wrote oh yeah, I voted for the Communist Party for president. That was just a youthful lark. He drew no counterintelligence lessons from this. He drew no lessons at all about subversion of our system, setting us against each other and really getting a mindset in the American population and people who become our leaders. You know anonymous bureaucrats to CIA directors, to presidents to say that huge, pervasive central government is the answer to all our problems and diminishment of the American individual is no longer something we should aspire to, or is something we should aspire to is the role of central government. So we trade like in China. We trade our freedoms for supposed security. So that's the mentality that's being brought in. So imagine an intelligence service hiring people like that over time and it's hiring other good people too. But the thing is those good people become demoralized, they become driven out, they retire early, they don't have replacements because the system has now become radicalized and the nervous system in the middle is recruiting wokeness and you can see this in public. Go to add FBI jobs on X and you can see they're only searching for woke new recruits into the bureau.

Speaker 6:

So now that we get to the Trump administration, it seems like the central intelligence agency and the FBI, at least to the upper echelons, are actually working against Trump. I mean, you look at the direct actions of Comey himself, this narrative that they're putting out about the Russians and collusions all completely false. They even tap Joe Biden at one point to come up with the Logan Act, to go after General Michael Flynn. Do you feel like these agencies had been fully weaponized at this point where really the executive power is supposed to lie in Trump? He's supposed to be the commander in chief, but it seems like a lot of this stuff was obviously out of his power and they were directly working against him.

Speaker 7:

Yes. Now, they were set up so that they could not be weaponized, so that they could not be used as political instruments. So, even though the president is commander in chief of the military, he's not commander in chief of the FBI or the CIA. I mean, he does direct the CIA on what to do and what not to do, but he can't direct them to to weaponize against the public. And the FBI is supposed to be an autonomous organization. But what you have now starting under Obama is the complete weaponization of the CIA and the FBI for political purposes. And this is where the FBI brings in a foreign intelligence officer, meaning an intelligence officer from a foreign country, christopher Steele. So he's British, but he's still foreign, it's not us and then with a Russian asset, who the FBI still believed was a Putin asset, to come up with this dossier. That was fabricated about Trump colluding with the Russians, that's what he's saying.

Speaker 6:

And to this day they just threw that out of court. You know he tried to sue and say, hey, look at what they did to him. There seems to be a double standard in the justice system here. We got to take another break. When we come back, I want to talk about where we are today with the FBI and the CIA. If there's any hope of reform, or perhaps you're taking the position of somebody like Vivek Ramaswamy that says, essentially, these, these agencies have to go, and on day one he would have cut them in half and then taking them basically out altogether Is that a real solution? Is that viable? We're going to talk about that and more with J Michael Waller, the author of Big Intel.

Speaker 3:

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Speaker 1:

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Speaker 3:

I'd have my mom call the number on the screen. You, you come see me alone. We'll work it out, really, we will.

Speaker 6:

And we are back with J Michael Waller. We're talking about the Barack Obama administration into the Trump administration and basically how they were weaponized against the Trump administration. Now we get into the 2020 election, you know I'll outwardly say that I believe it was stolen beyond recognition and there's a plethora of evidence for that. However, almost in unison, you had the intelligence community saying otherwise, especially in the realm of cybersecurity and even prior to that. We now have the infamous letter of over 50 intelligence officials saying that the Hunter Biden laptop had all the hallmarks of Russian disinformation. So they wouldn't outwardly say it was Russian disinformation, I suspect, as most of them knew it was absolutely real, but they used coded language to make that assertion and put that into the public arena for narrative management. So are we just completely lost? What are we doing with these agencies and how do you feel they've behaved now under that Biden administration these past several years?

Speaker 7:

Well, the good part is that they finally woken up most of the public by overstepping to the fact that they are big and out of control, and it's got to be something we can do. We only have one more chance because, the way the personnel system has worked, you have four more years of recruitment into these agencies. The remaining good guys who are in there, they're doing their jobs, they're trying. Some of them are there for the right reasons, some for the wrong reasons. They'll be gone. They'll be a tritit out. So you'll have now these agencies that really are not under any control, not under any oversight. They'll be pretty much autonomous. So this is the last year to do something about it. If you, there's something that can be done. When President Trump came in the first time, he didn't have a plan. He thought you could just take the top off these agencies, put my own people in and they'll do what needs to be done. He didn't understand the nature of the problem at all and he essentially allowed the CIA to run itself. And then he had the FBI. He put in a weak guy like Chris Ray. He comes out and he looks strong. He's really weak. He's being pushed around by the woke feminizes who are running the bureau. He does what they want. So Trump puts him in place because Chris Christie suggested him. So Trump had no real team. He had no real action plan. Now he's developing one. So that's one chance to know what to do. So in big intel, I have an action plan or a plan for an action plan in there to suggest what to do. It's easy to say let's just get rid of the FBI and defund it. But we need a counterintelligence service, we need a federal agency that does a lot of the functions, not all that the FBI does. So what do you do? So I suggest carving it up into its different constituent elements that need to be preserved. Transferring the criminal investigative unit to the US Marshall service. Transferring the FBI Academy to the Marshall service, which has had comparatively very few scandals and it was founded by the founding fathers, so it has legitimacy. Take the certain counterterrorism elements of it. We are not needed. Abolish those positions. That way the person will have to leave the federal government service. Otherwise you can't fire federal employees. Take certain other elements and transfer them to other agencies. Even if it's not the ideal solution, it's to break the FBI into pieces while keeping the functions, then deal with those other agencies later and then pretty soon. Now you don't have a central federal bureau of investigation anymore. Everything's been dispersed Beyond that. You take a lot of powers that the central government has and you push it down to the state level. Let the states have their authority back. So that would empower county sheriffs in every county, and this is where every American citizen, every viewer here, has a role to play. We don't really think of who we vote for for county sheriff every year. Now we should think of it. We have to ask the sheriffs and we have to ask the sheriff candidates what will you do to limit the power of federal agents in our county? You have the authority to limit what they do. You can even deny them access to the county because the sheriff and the local police are the eyes and ears of the bureaus. But the sheriff can say I'm not allowing you in because you are breaking the law or because you're doing something unconstitutional. The sheriffs have authority for that. So the sheriffs need to know that the public knows they need to be backed up where they know. But many sheriffs don't know, they don't realize what they do. So this is the time, this election year, to ask every sheriff and candidate about that and to back up the ones who are doing the right thing and replace the ones who won't. So those are the two parts A new president coming in, like Trump, who has a real action plan and a real team like he did not have before. And second, american citizen action to empower the sheriffs at the state and local level.

Speaker 6:

Well, we are big advocates here of sheriffs and local law enforcement, really separation of powers. However, again, we just had this recent Supreme Court decision that really craps all over states rights and tries to consolidate power on a federal level via the border, but sets a terrible precedent for all sorts of other things. So I would be in 100% agreement with the sheriffs and even the disbanding Vivek Ramaswamy talks about that. He does talk about the US Marshall service and that aspect of law enforcement. I think that we also have to disband homeland security. But I have to ask you with that plan and let's say he gets in, we'll save the final segment. For, let's say, if he goes to jail instead, who would be the right team at this point? I'm a fan of people like Rand Paul and Mike Lee. It seems like Michael Flynn was clearly targeted in the beginning. Maybe you bring somebody like that back, but who else would you like to see in an administration that can finally take back this country? You need people like the ones you mentioned.

Speaker 7:

You need somebody like Rand Paul with the philosophical outlook. You need somebody like Mike Lee with the constitutional outlook and expertise they're ideal members of. We need them in the Senate, but we also need them in an administration. You need people who I would not trust. Anybody who rose above the rank of colonel in the military with rare exceptions, simply because they tend to be brown notes. Now Mike Flynn is no brown no-sir, so he would be an exception. But really, in looking at the military now, you have to go along, to get along and to get promoted, and it's gonna be the Obama generals who are reaching down to promote their favorite colonels to become generals. So I really don't trust anybody above colonel and really above the lieutenant colonel or the equivalent, because that's where the real brown nosing begins and that's where they become super careerists. So I would say I would much rather have some experienced non-commissioned officers like sergeants and some so to with a backbone of the military, to come in and to take a lot of these places. You have people in the FBI who are really great people who are there because they know that if they leave this vital post that they're in, some rainbow-haired transgender lunatic is going to be taking their place, and they can't have that, so really I'd rather have them in place watching the Chinese communists than anybody else. So there are people inside that you can cherry pick, but you can't identify them because they'll be retaliated against. And then people from the proud and the secretary, like you may.

Speaker 4:

Vivek who understands the?

Speaker 7:

administrative state, so much he would be ideal to be the architect of dismantling it. I mean, I think he makes a great either vice president or secretary of state.

Speaker 6:

I like a lot of what Vivek Ramaswamy has to say. I like a lot of what Vivek Ramaswamy has to offer. I think a lot of his ideas are out there. He is unproven politically Again, actions speak louder than words. But I'd have to agree, I'd love to see him in the administration. We got to take one more break. When we come back, I want to get your view on if they actually put Trump in prison, because I almost think that's the foregone conclusion. What does it mean for 2024, the election cycle? And can they sneak somebody like Nikki Haley in final segment of Making Sense of the Madness after this? This is Sean Morgan with Patriot TV.

Speaker 8:

Well thank you for that. Being a first responder whether you're law, fire, ems or dispatch you're exposed to many terrible things, and our suicide rate is 50% higher than all regular civilians. It's really based on the horrific things that we see on a regular basis traumatic accidents, suicides, homicides, drownings, cardiac arrest. What the Foundation does is they help raise money to be able to pay for the costly but very much needed treatment that we received once we're diagnosed with PTS.

Speaker 11:

Right, and so these challenge coins that people can get, they can actually give them to a first responder they know as a form of a thank you and helps your Foundation raise funds. So if one of you wants to get one or more challenge coins, you can go to firstresponder911.org and get them there. Thank you, patriot, and thank you all the first responders out there for your service. We're going to support you, god bless.

Speaker 6:

MUSIC, final segment of Making Sense of the Madness. We are with J Michael Waller, the author of Big Intel, and I got to ask you I foresee them convicting Trump in one of these kangaroo court cases. We're already in unprecedented territory. Obviously, they'd like to do so before the election. I think that's why they're trying to keep Nikki Haley in the game and somehow pawn her off as the primary candidate for the Republicans. Whether or not Biden makes it is a big question mark at this point. What does the country look like if they put Trump in jail? What does the country look like if someone like Biden or Haley gets in and they don't put Trump in jail? Is there much of a difference, and have we already kind of crossed the Rubicon in some sense?

Speaker 7:

We're crossing the Rubicon now. We're not yet onto the other side. That will be determined on whether or not. Now let's take the names out of it and let's look at it just without names. The ruling party and its state security apparatus wants to put the leading political opponent in prison and is bending every rule, breaking every procedure, in order to make sure that that political opponent is put in prison. Now, if you applied that to the US government's current standards the state department's current standards for elections in other countries and judging whether or not another country is a real democracy benefiting US support, you'll find that the United States government violates its own standards. It's violating Jimmy Carter's standards, who set up at his Carter Center the standards for monitoring elections around the world. So what we are preaching to the rest of the world, we're not even practicing at home. So these globalists want globalism, but they still want to maintain their tight control here at home. That's the Rubicon we're crossing right now.

Speaker 6:

So what do you think the country looks like if someone like Biden gets a second administration, or anybody but Trump at this point, seeing that Rama Swami is out of the race gets into office?

Speaker 7:

You've got to really be clear that Biden's not running the country. Obama is the only American president who has left office and stayed in Washington DC and then staffed his successor administration. In this case, biden, it's not Biden loyalists who are there. You look at his National Security Council staff. You look at the Hamas man who's in charge of intelligence programs on the National Security Council at the White House. He was an Obama person. Then he worked for the UN Palestinian Relief Agency, which has been arming and assisting an international terrorist group as designated by the federal government. So these are the types of people you have at the top of our intelligence apparatus. Some of them come and go, but their friends stay. So there's a system then to make sure that that stays in place and a subsystem beneath that that doesn't want any disruption in the status quo, not necessarily for political control, but for financial control. It's a huge industry. It's like what Eisenhower warned of a military industrial complex. We have a huge intelligence industrial complex, which are two of the reasons, then, why nine of the wealthiest counties in America are in the Washington DC area. There's no indigenous industry in Washington DC. It's all central government, and they have to stay. If you disrupt that. You're disrupting all these livelihoods of the people who run everything.

Speaker 6:

We have run out of time. The book is Big Intel how the FBI and CIA Went from Cold War Heroes to Deep State Villains. J Michael Wallach, thank you so much for joining us and thank you, guys, for joining us here at patriottv, monday through Friday, 6 PM Eastern, where the truth lives. Remember, to me, guys, it is not about left or right, it is always about right and wrong. I absolutely love you, guys, and I'll see you on the flip side. Monday 24. Introducing to Today's Story you, you.

(Cont.) Former CIA Asset Blows The Whistle On Big Intel | MSOM Ep. 928